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Discussion: the syllable as a locus for tonal generalizations
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pzioga |
the syllable as a locus for tonal generalizations
Feb 15 2008, 3:31 PM EST
The discussion of Hakha Lai by Hyman and VanBik makes crucial reference to "syllable" in stating generalizations about where we find tonal contrasts. E.g., F, R, and L tones contrast only in so called smooth syllables (bimoraic syllables which end in a vowel or sonorant). Monomoraic sylables do not bear tone and so called stopped-syllables ending in voiceless stops or glottalized sonorants do not behave like smooth syllables. However, words are largely monosyllabic in this language, so syllable and word appear to cover the same descriptive ground in this language.
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pzioga |
1. RE: the syllable as a locus for tonal generalizations
Feb 15 2008, 3:45 PM EST
Unfortunately, I can't figure out how to edit my own posts... So I am adding an additional post to point out that Hyman and VanBik also make crucial reference to syllable in their generalization that Hakha Lai allows contour tones within syllables, but conspires to prevent tone level changes across syllables. Again, because words are largely monosyllabic in Hakha Lai, perhaps reference to syllable is not crucial. Here is link to their paper: http://www.ling.sinica.edu.tw/eip/FILES/journal/2007.3.9.4099672.99176389.pdf
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cecairns |
2. RE: the syllable as a locus for tonal generalizations
Feb 16 2008, 10:11 AM EST
This is very interesting. I just downloaded their paper and merely skimmed it for now. But it does seem to be syllables, not words, that you'd want as alignment units for tone. This relates to the whole question of what can align with what, and at what levels, and so on. Another point that their paper addresses (based on a cursory look) is the layers of opacity involved in analyzing these alignment phenomena. This arises also in aligning song to language -- see Dell's handout, where he has to specify different phonological levels in order to analyze song alignment.
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cecairns |
3. RE: the syllable as a locus for tonal generalizations
Feb 16 2008, 10:13 AM EST
Oh, I meant to mention -- I don't think you can edit your own posts. You also can't put hyperlinks in them. Not sure about fonts that require unicode compliant machines to read them.
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cecairns |
4. RE: the syllable as a locus for tonal generalizations
Feb 16 2008, 12:41 PM EST
The Hyman VanBik article about Hakha Lai has evidence that the syllable is necessary as a locus for tonal generalizations. The language has a constraint against tonal contours in adjacent syllables, but it tolerates tonal contours within syllables. Therefore we need to specify some unit that describes the domains within which contours are allowed or prohibited. This looks like the syllable.Lots more interesting stuff in that article, re opacity, directionality of rule application, etc. Would love a Wiki discussion of the implications of that article as a focus. 3 out of 3 found this valuable. Do you? |
ulfsbjorninn |
5. RE: the syllable as a locus for tonal generalizations
Mar 24 2008, 1:30 PM EDT
I agree this sounds very interesting. But as to wether this makes reference to a syllable, I would be careful, particularly because it seems that the 1 "syllable" minimal-maximal word (and compounds) languages such as Hakka Lai, Cantonese etc... have this 'syllable' which corresponds minimally to a certain size. This size, in Goh's 1997, Kaye 2001 (for Mandarin) and in my talk (for Vietnamese) makes explicit reference to at least two nuclei, one strong - one weak. As I argued in Leipzig, this templatic minimal-maximal word size corresponds with a maximally binary branching trochaic foot (cf. Charette 2007 for Turkish). What this buys us is that we can understand the interrelation of word-hood, stressability (vis a vis my talk on the minor syllables in Khmer vs. Kammu) and the foot. What we loose, however, is the notion that this phonological process is making reference to the syllable and not to the foot-domain ie. minimal word-domain of GP. So what do we think? Can we really talk about minimal word effects in 'monosyllabic' languages without having the foot (and its ONON created template), I am doubtful! ulfsbjorninn 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
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ulfsbjorninn |
6. RE: the syllable as a locus for tonal generalizations
Mar 24 2008, 1:39 PM EDT
therefore, (sorry I got sidetracked)can we know that the tonal restrictions across 'syllables' are referring to syllables and not to minimal-word-domains ie. feet best, ulfsbjorninn 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
